Sunday, March 7, 2010

Carlyle Canada's chain-of-command fraud in NATO 9/11

Open e-mail sent September 18, 2006 to:

Canadian Minister of Public Safety, the Honourable Stockwell Day,
U.S. Vice-President Richard Cheney

David Hawkins, Forensic Economist at Hawks' CAFE
Foundation Scholar, Cambridge University
British Columbia, Canada Tel: 604-542-0891

Ccs include:

Canadian Prime Minister, Stephen Harper

Steven Jones and Jim Fetzer,
Co-chairs of Scholars for 9/11 Truth

Dear Minister Day and Vice-President Cheney
Re: Carlyle Canada's chain-of-command fraud for a NATO 9/11

I believe that on 9/11, at least five members of Carlyle Group
Canada, namely Frank Carlucci, Paul Desmarais, Lynton Wilson,
Laurent Beaudoin and Frank McKenna, executed a chain-of-command
fraud on the American people and sabotaged U.S. defences
to 'simulated' al-Qaeda attacks during a series of bogus war games
staged by CANR, the Canadian arm of NORAD, and commanded by the
Canadian Privy Council.

Carlyle Canada appear to have ordered the U.K. company, Amec, to
sabotage Nortel Network's internet communications systems at the
World Trade Center and the Pentagon's U.S. Naval Command Center and
transfer Nortel's U.S. chain-of-command technology to EADS in Europe
for use by NATO leaders under a NATO partnership-for-peace program
('PfP') developed by the apparently-treasonous Clinton White House.

I suggest your governments investigate the role of the Carlyle Group
during the 9/11 attacks - see notes below - and find out who
switched Nortel's VoIP communications from the Pentagon and the
presidential chain-of-command to EADS in Europe for use by NATO
leaders in NATO's bogus "Global Guardian" continuity-of-government

Yours sincerely,

David Hawkins

Notes: "Carlyle Canada's chain-of-command fraud for a NATO 9/11"

"Week ending September 16, 2001 .. European Aeronautic Defense and
Space Company (EADS) and Nortel Networks .. transfer to EADS Defense
and Security Networks (EDSN) of Cogent Defense Systems, a UK leader
in defense and security telecommunications systems currently
division of a Nortel Networks' UK subsidiary .. aims to turn EDSN,
EADS subsidiary in which Nortel Networks is a shareholder, into
global leader in telecommunications for defense and security systems
based on civilian technologies .. transfer to EDSN of the IP
Telephony M6500 .. from Matra Nortel Communications (MNC), a Nortel
Networks subsidiary .. including Internet Protocol (IP) telephony ..
core technology of EDSN security solutions"

"Frank McKenna is a member of the Carlyle Canada Advisory Board ..
other members include Peter Lougheed, former premier of Alberta;
Power Corp.'s Paul Desmarais; Bombardier's Laurent Beaudoin; former
Canadian ambassador to the United States Allan Gotlieb; and Carlyle
senior staff members Frank Carlucci and James A. Baker III ..
relationship between Carlyle Group and bin Laden family extends into
Canada. Frank Carlucci, chairman of the Carlyle Group from 1993 to
2003, was a member of the board of Nortel as early as 1996 and
served as chairman of Nortel in 2000-2001. Nortel had a business
partnership with the Saudi Binladen Group through its Baud
Telecommunications Company, which resold Nortel-built
telecommunications equipment in Saudi Arabia"

"Manufactured Shock"

Below is a transcription of an interview with David Hawkins and George Noory, broadcast on Coast To Coast AM 9/11 2006 . I accept sole responsibility for errors, omissions, implied or explicit allegations, and the selection of the images inserted in the text. I acknowledge all published materials as copyright of their owners. This presentation has been made freely-available online to conform to U.S. President Thomas Jefferson's challenge "An informed public will make the right decision" and my belief that only a globally-informed public will have the knowledge and resources to destroy the racketeering influenced and corrupt organization of intellectual elites, world bankers and crime bosses, which, I allege, coordinated the 9/11 attacks and cultivates the 'al-Qaeda' terrorist myth. David Hawkins; context at - presentation subject to revision without notice.

GEORGE: Good evening David, welcome to Coast to Coast.

DAVID: Good evening George. Thank you for having me on your show.

GEORGE: Sure. Now you would be considered an expert of the fields that you are in and you've got a novel theory in this particular case. Tell us a little bit about yourself beyond this bio David.

DAVID: My background…I worked with a company, a very well known French company called Schlumberger in the international oil industry and, as you mentioned there I coordinated artificial intelligence and geoscience research at the Ridgefield Research Center in 1981 and I started to wonder about how human beings, having a lot of field experience about how experts looked at information and interpreted whether there was oil in the oil field, I tried to understand how they pulled that altogether and eventually I developed a very powerful computational model and actually built systems that reasoned in ways similar to human beings when they were tracking assets through the earth or, for that matter, just coming to 911, Osama Bin Laden, a few weeks after 911, he made this extraordinary quotation that I think a lot of people have missed. He said "We have three independent networks to move al Qaeda assets around the world, and all of the resources of the British and Americans cannot stop us". Now, I consider myself, well, I am British. When I read that in Time Magazine the hairs on the back of my neck went up because, I think in the heat of the moment, Osama Bin Laden was speaking very precisely and very accurately about what the strengths and limitations of al Qaeda were. Basically I think he was saying, "We can't do very much. We might be able to send a novice pilot who's ready to commit suicide with a few box cutters, but we're not very good at anything in particular. For example, we could take over a plane and crash it somewhere, but we wouldn't necessarily be able to crash it in the U.S. Naval Command Center in the Pentagon". So, over the last five years, I've been trying to take my background and apply it to identifying the three independent networks that al Qaeda used and, more particularly, and this has happened over the last two weeks, the center that coordinated those three networks and helped pull off the entire plot, so, I think those are where my forensic economic skills, if you will, and I guess Osama Bin Laden's challenge was to us all. What are the three networks that he used and how is it coordinated?

GEORGE: And I think what is so important here, David, is because just watching this ABC special over the last couple of nights, as they were dramatizing Ramzi Yousef and as I've also talked with a former ABC reporter, Peter Lance, who's done a great job tracking that as well. Yousef used to say, "I can take these buildings down but I need explosives and I need money". Without the money none of this would have happened, would it?

DAVID: You're absolutely right and those three networks…immediately when I heard, or I saw the quotation from Osama Bin Laden I said, `well, what three networks would there be that all of the resources of the British and the Americans couldn't stop?'. So I started to think, `Well, they're not primarily in the English language. They might be French or Arabic, but what kinds of networks would they be?'. Well I think one of them, as you've just implied, would be a financial intelligence network. How do you move the huge amounts of money and how do you exploit the great opportunity, for example, when the New York Stock Market closed down for four days? The second network, I think, George, would be an electronic intelligence network, characteristic of any major battlefield or military mission where command control, communications, intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance have to be brought together. And the third, and perhaps the most important network, is the human intelligence network. You can't just place explosives in buildings and fire them off and expect the building to come down in a planned way. As I think you mentioned earlier, there were three towers that came down on September the 11th. One and Two, well that was the spectacular shock stuff, but building number Three (WTC7) came down at 5:20 p.m. in it's own footprint, but very interestingly, down in the debris pile of Ground Zero, the hot spot scatter of molten steel that was still burning months after 9/11…

GEORGE: Right.

DAVID: …from a thermodynamic point of view, and that really talks about the level of disorder, was exactly the kind of, the same kind of thermodynamic signature in [WTC] building number Seven as in buildings One and Two. So what I, as an applied mathematician [or] thermodynamicist would say is, whatever it was that brought down Seven, and remember, that wasn't a plane, because no plane ever hit building Seven, must have been added to the impact of the plane and the jet fuel fires to buildings One and Two because there was the same distribution of molten steel in the debris piles.

GEORGE: There was a quote attributed to Larry Silverstein, who was the property owner of the World Trade Center, who got a lot of insurance money, David, because of this and he was overheard saying, you know, "We had to pull it, we had to pull it, basically" and anybody in the demolition business knows that that means `bring the building down'. And I think that that's one of the quotes that has had so many people who believe in an alternative reason for 911, have cited, as the possibilities in this entire field. Would you agree?

DAVID: Yes, and that's very interesting because in [WTC] building number Seven, I believe we have the germ of the coordination of the three networks mentioned by Osama Bin Laden. Most people believe that Larry Silverstein was the owner of the property. In fact, in buildings One and Two, towers One and Two, what he had actually done is he had got a mortgage for a ninety nine year lease from the Port Authority of New Jersey and New York, and he put in a minority of the money. The bulk of the money that went into towers One and Two came through a mortgage broker called General Motors Acceptance Corporation, which is a wholly owned subsidiary of General Motors, and sitting behind that, and this is totally fascinating I think, is, I believe, the world's largest private pension fund which is the teachers' national pension fund – TIAA CREF - which actually handles the pension fund investments of three million members, senior faculty members and college employees right across the United States, including the American University of Beirut and Cairo, and I might come back to that. Quite extraordinary, the owners of the mortgage on building number Seven, up to October 2000, was the teachers' national pension fund and they sold it to Blackstone Group, but they retained, through their private equity arm, an insured interest in building number Seven, and when Larry Silverstein said that he `pulled it', I think what he's really saying is that the people who owned the mortgage on building number Seven ordered the firefighters, or the demolition experts of the contractor working on that building, a British company called Amec, they were ordered to pull it in order to collect the insurance and subsequently they collected $861,000,000.00 (861 million dollars) of insurance and that was shared amongst the teachers' national pension fund private equity group.

GEORGE: Now, for the building to go down, for it to be pulled, for explosives to be placed in it, and let's talk primarily about [WTC] building Seven, at least for this moment, I mean they couldn't have done it at that moment…it had to have been there from the get-go!

DAVID: Well, I am an expert in explosives and I built a lot of improvised explosive devices during my career in the oil industry so I know a little of this subject, but, I've been thinking long and hard about the alleged demolition of the three towers because the firefighters, before the aerial of the Motorola analog radios they were equipped with were, I believe, sabotaged, they were calling in and saying, I understand in the south tower, "We've got two small fires burning, (remember it was black smoke) it's under control."

GEORGE: Right.

DAVID: Now, in the demolitions, if that's what they were, from the points of impact, or just below the points of impact in [WTC] Towers One and Two, was a wave travelling downwards and that can be contrasted with building number Seven, which was a bottom up demolition, so, if they were placing charges, they'd have to be able to rearrange them very quickly on the fly to get a different pattern of demolition.

GEORGE: Alright, have there ever been any witnesses, David, that said…"we saw the explosives experts changing things, putting explosives in [WTC] building Seven at that time, or even before that?"

DAVID: I can actually explain how there would be no witnesses, you see…


DAVID: There were seven underground levels to each of these buildings, [WTC] Towers One, Two and Seven. In [WTC] Towers One and Two there were elevator shafts that went up to the 78th floor of the sky lobby…

GEORGE: Alright…

DAVID: I think what they did, and this is a theory, and I can, if there was more time could…

GEORGE: Oh yeah, you're with me all hour so you've got the time…

DAVID: I think what they did is they put either solid fuel or liquid fuel rocket motors inside the freight elevators at the underground levels, they locked them off from public access so that the public wouldn't have known that these were reserved exclusively for this purpose, and the British company, Amec, this is very interesting, they had a partnership contract with Citigroup for the diesel systems, the diesel fuel lines in [WTC] building number Seven, and another one of it's contracts that it was getting on a regular basis from the American government was `sabotage vulnerability testing'.

GEORGE: That's interesting…

DAVID: And what that means is, in a, for example, and that is what I believe was happening on 9/11, a `continuity of government exercise', a contractor who was able to organize simulated sabotage attacks would be employed to test the ability of New York State, or even the American government itself, to survive a sabotage attack and transfer administrative and executive and legislative and judicial functions to another order of government to prevent panic in the streets, etc, etc. And, Amec was North America's leading company in the providing of sabotage vulnerability assessments and it was doing it for, for example, for the Strategic Petroleum Reserve of the United States…it was doing it, George, in the Pentagon.

GEORGE: So when do you think these explosives were placed in these buildings?

DAVID: I think for the continuity of government exercise, being staged by NATO, the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, under the Partnership for Peace Program, they had rigged the [WTC] buildings and the Pentagon and Logan Airport with different saboteur types, and I'm quoting that phrase, "saboteur type" comes from the Amec web site. And, I think prior to that Tuesday, overnight probably, they had placed these very high temperature, ultra high temperature rocket engines in the freight elevator shafts and they had locked off the elevator shafts and those elevators were controlled from the 23rd floor of [WTC] building number Seven, which was the Mayor's Office For Emergency Management, which is a public/private partnership in which Amec was involved and they were setting up various sabotage scenarios to determine whether or not New York State and New York City could continue with government in the event of these sabotage simulations.

GEORGE: Well, these simulations, did they truly expect to detonate them?

DAVID: Well, this is the magic…

GEORGE: Alright, we'll be back…let's ask you that question again in just a moment…


GEORGE: David Hawkins is our guest this hour…David, so why in God's name do you put live explosives in these buildings if it was just going to be a sabotage type test or exercise?

DAVID: I think all of the innocent participants would have believed, quite obviously, that the simulation was nothing more than a simulation. But, you can imagine the company, this company, Amec, on the ground, and interestingly enough, Boeing in the air…insiders of those two companies or the people who have contracted them to do the sabotage assessment, they would have known if the defenses were `stood down' sufficiently for them to switch from a real continuity of government exercise with a bogus sabotage attack to a bogus continuity of government exercise and a real sabotage attack so, that's what happened. They discovered that they could get the United States Air Force to stand down on the basis that the USAF thought they were playing a war game and they were testing out electronic hijacking technology and they were able to switch, actually through the command center in Cheyenne Mountain, to a real attack…

GEORGE: Now you say `they' David, who, who might they be?

DAVID: Going back up that food chain, you remember I mentioned earlier the teachers' private equity group, right?

GEORGE: Right…

DAVID: The "Teachers" is a $380,000,000,000.00 (380 billion) dollar fund…it's the largest private pension fund in the world. In 1989 it was passed into private equity custody and basically, a small group of people, and they describe themselves as fifty prominent individuals, of which I know the names of 28, I don't know the names of the remaining 22…they took the pension fund of the professors and faculty members of America's finest universities and they moved into what is called `alternative investment' which is real estate distress debt, which is a nice name for loan sharking…and what's called event arbitrage and that's a bit of a technical phrase and it's not my area of expertise, but I've tried to get my head around it. If, for example, you're not getting sufficient rent to pay the mortgage on building number Seven, one way of getting your money back is to insure it and knock it down…

GEORGE: Right…

DAVID: OK? Equally, with towers One and Two, the north and south towers, they weren't full of tenants, they were older buildings, people were moving out to different areas, you know, following the dot com magic `you can stay at home, click on the machine' etc., and so one way of getting your money back on the ninety nine year lease at 3.2 billion dollars, was to insure the hell out of it, knock it over and collect unbelievably George, they collected a double occurrence!

GEORGE: But to knock it over you need a real excuse, or you're charged with arson, right?

DAVID: Exactly, and that's where, you know, my phrase that I sent you separately, there was `Manufactured Shock'. There were three stages to the explosions that destroyed the buildings. The first one was the visual shock, when the planes flew into the buildings and created the fireball and everyone was extremely impressed but the mere fact that that fireball went out into the open air means that it wasn't available to heat the steel inside the building so there was actually very little energy left to heat the steel, right? And in the particular case of the south tower, the flame started burning black smoke, which means not enough oxygen is getting to it, so it's probably around 600 to 700°F. Steel melts at 2,800°F. When those towers came down, if you look at the ejection velocity of the girders that are blown out sideways, they're blown out at about 100 miles per hour. Well, George, gravity doesn't do that.

GEORGE: Alright, in your theory of a plan to get insurance money, where does Osama Bin Laden and al Qaeda fit in?

DAVID: Osama Bin Laden….um… there's a very well known Canadian, actually he's not terribly well known, a guy called Maurice Strong, who helped set up the UN "Oil for Food" scam…he's a Canadian guy, he was senior advisor to the President of the World Bank, and he hates the Anglosphere in America, and he said in 1981, in a story he was going to write…"The greatest threat to the survival of the planet are the rich industrialized countries…we have a duty to destroy them and the way we would do that…we would take a position in the international stock markets and commodities and we would hire mercenaries and we would cause a panic…" And al Qaeda are hired mercenaries…

GEORGE: I agree with that…

DAVID: I don't say that al Qaeda doesn't exist, but remember what Bin Laden said at the beginning of this interview… he said we have three independent networks to move our assets around. It's a cowboy outfit. You know they're going to wield a box cutter, maybe an AK-47, set up a little explosive, but 911 was a brilliantly coordinated military project. Remember, there were three crime scenes, including [WTC] buildings One and Two, which we saw because the planes hit them, but building Seven is part of the 911 scenario. On floors 11, 12 and 13 were the offices of the Securities and Exchange Commission and all of the investigations into the dot com scandals, including WorldCom, run by Citigroup, and for which Citigroup has paid 3.4 billion dollars, was vaporized, George.

GEORGE: All the records gone…

DAVID: Gone! Right? The chairman of the Securities and Exchange Commission, Arthur Levitt, he resigned in May 2001, he became senior advisor to the Carlyle Group…the following year he became the overseer of the teachers' national pension fund.

GEORGE: So your theory is that this fund hires al Qaeda, masterminds this incredible act and it's all for a scam to make money?

DAVID: No, there were two objectives George. Going back to the arbitraged event, if you recollect, the New York Stock Exchange closed down for four days, but the Chicago Mercantile Exchange and the future's market continued running…

GEORGE: Why is that?

DAVID: Now, the reason, well, the reason they wanted the New York Stock Exchange to close down is, when you are arbitraging, for example, and you're long in New York and you're short in the Chicago Mercantile Exchange, what that means is that you've got a lot of Enron stock on your hands and you need to crash the stock and sell it short, but you can only make money if the traders in New York have stopped trading, because as soon as they see that arbitrage gap grow, they get into it, right?

GEORGE: I see…

DAVID: And the only way you can make serious arbitrage profits in a dotcom bubble market, because they all knew that Enron and Dynergy and Qwest and World Com and Tyco were about to burst, is to shut down the New York Stock Exchange, so they needed, my phrase is, to manufacture a shock in New York and then make their profit in Chicago…

GEORGE: Absolutely incredible…and I assume they did make those profits?

DAVID: Oh, totally. And, the guys who made the profits, the guys who made the biggest profits were CAI, which I think is an anagram for CIA, but I'll come back to that, the CAI private equity group which manages and invests the teachers' [TIAA-CREF] national pension fund on behalf of senior faculty members across America.

GEORGE: Why is it that the Securities and Exchange Commission never revealed to us who made those short sales of insurance companies and airlines that day as well?

DAVID: Now…well, here we're moving on to the third network…remember I mentioned three networks, or bin Laden mentioned three networks. The first network, I believe, is the financial network which is the teachers' private equity group…the second network is the NATO Command and Control System, that I believe was used to control the military assets, and the third asset is the mob. Now, very interesting, you remember I mentioned this company, Amec, that got the job for testing the saboteur types that would be most successful…

GEORGE: Who, who paid them for this, by the way?

DAVID: I think it was the Teachers' [TIAA-CREF] private equity group…


DAVID: I think they were retained privately, as well as Boeing. Now, when they come to the scene of the crime afterwards, guess who gets the contract, George, to clean up?

GEORGE: The mob…

DAVID: Amec! Right? And the first guy on the scene…

GEORGE: And they clean it up pretty fast too, don't they?

DAVID: Yes, because three groups of people showed up the day of or the day after and you'd think there'd be the yellow tapes around, it would be scene of crime? It wasn't. Teamsters Local 813, which is the New York Sanitation Department showed up and turned the hoses on and started flushing the body bits into the sewers, Waste Management, Incorporated got to operate the meshes to see which body parts would go through, well that, George, is a George Soros investment, and it turns out that Amec employed a reputed boss of the Luchese crime family to take it out to Fresh Kills Landfill.

GEORGE: OK, let's step back a little bit David, because it is well known that we were aware that these fundamentalists were training, were trying to get their pilots licenses, were trying to get schooled in flight…we know that Bin Laden had a hatred for the United States, that he was financing terror. All that was real. All that happened, right?

DAVID: Absolutely…absolutely. But, look at the flying skills of these guys…the instructors said they could barely fly a Cessna, right?


DAVID: These guys, Hani Hanjour, who was allegedly in Flight 77, he executed a 270 degree pivoted turn from 7,000 feet to ground zero, about ten feet above the Pentagon lawn at 540 miles an hour in two and a half minutes and he went through the first floor window and it wasn't wedge I, under construction, guess what was the other side…? It was the US Naval Command Center, George.

GEORGE: That's strange. OK, why mastermind the other two hijackings? The reported one that hit the Pentagon and then the crash in Pennsylvania, a plane that they thought was going to go for the White House or the Capitol?

DAVID: OK…that was going to hit the Capitol and it would have decapitated the American administration because Flight 93, which is the one that allegedly came down in the field outside Shanksville, PA., was forty one minutes late, George. Had it left on time, it would have been over Washington at exactly the same moment as Flight 77.

GEORGE: Alright…were those two diversions to take away from the World Trade Center financial hit?

DAVID: No. The World Trade Center was primarily iconic to destroy American capitalism and make that money…

GEORGE: To make the money doing that…

DAVID: To make the money… The Pentagon and the Capitol, these were political objectives.

GEORGE: So this group was truly out to destroy America?

DAVID: Yes, yes it was. And remember what Maurice Strong said…and I believe Maurice Strong is one of the fifty people in the teachers' private equity group…he said, "America represents the greatest threat to the survival of the planet"…actually he said ` the rich industrialized countries"…"We would take a position in the international stock markets, we will hire mercenaries, we will cause a panic and we will jam open the market".

GEORGE: Where did he say this?

DAVID: He said it in 1991 to a Western Star reporter about a story that he would like to write, right? Unfortunately, this clown went on to become the architect of the United Nations `Oil for Food' scam.

GEORGE: Why isn't our government publicly investigating this…other than the push for terrorism and the chase of al Qaeda?

DAVID: They've half gone after him because they've indicted a guy called Tongsun Park, who is the colleague of Maurice Strong who carried a million dollar bribe from Saddam Hussein in Baghdad, wired to a man in Jordan, it was wired through to New York and it was sent up to Canada and it was invested in the then finance minister of Canada's Canada Steam Ship Lines and I believe that Maurice Strong bought Saddam Hussein a ticket for the 911 war games.

GEORGE: Well, why are we not publicizing it…why are we merely talking about the `war on terror' when there may be a bigger problem here?

DAVID: Because I can't get through to the people who matter, but, tonight is a big night for me, George, and because I've got through to you and I think because you have a lot of listeners, I believe and I hope and I pray that the research and discovery that I've made, I think now will have some momentum.

GEORGE: Well, David, I have always said that when anything happens follow the money and see who profits.

DAVID: Exactly…

GEORGE: And in this particular case, and I've said on this program before, that there is no doubt in my mind that al Qaeda was part of this…


GEORGE: A lot of people will claim that they were not, uh, truly they were. The evidence is there, that they tried, but I've always said that Bin Laden was a hired hit man.

DAVID: Yes. Can I mention the gyroscopes, if we've got time?


DAVID: OK. Boeing has recently, I believe this year, paid the largest corporate fine in history…$615,000,000.00 (615 million) dollars…

GEORGE: For what?

DAVID: To get the US Department of Justice to drop its investigations into about fourteen years of illegal modifications and procurement fraud, alright? One of those modifications, which is absolutely germane to the events of 911, is the installation of a GyroChip in the avionics of the Boeing 737's and the GyroChip is a military gyroscope which is also used, for example, in Raytheon's Maverick Missile. Now, here's what I think happened with Flight 11, well let's take Flight 77 because it's more spectacular. When the planes involved in the NORAD War Games got over the Pentagon or Washington, D.C., the United States Air Force base commanders believed they had control of those decoy hijackers through the GyroChip inside the avionics at Boeing's military satellite communications system. I believe those GyroChips and the avionics had been back-doored, so that they could actually block out the United States Air Force base commanders, and the planes could then be flown around the gyroscope, just like a missile, into the first floor of the Pentagon, where it killed Captain Gerald DeConto, who was the Duty Officer for the US Navy Command Center.

GEORGE: So you believe a plane indeed hit the Pentagon, not a missile?

DAVID: Absolutely, but, it looked like a passenger plane, right?

GEORGE: Right.

DAVID: And it may have been part of a convoy, where there was a decoy hijacker in front, etc., because with the Boeing satellite communication system they could patch in voices from three or four different planes and present it as a single voice log, if you see what I mean.

GEORGE: Well what happened to the occupants of what was supposed to have been that flight?

DAVID: I think they were in it, probably…

GEORGE: Ah…alright.

DAVID: But the plane had been modified, unbeknown, quite possibly, to Hani Hanjour who was flying the plane. Because I think Hani Hanjour…there were two kinds of hijackers…you remember you mentioned Ramzi Yousef?


DAVID: And 1993? Ramzi Yousef was what was described as an expert terrorist and the other guys were the expendables, right?

GEORGE: Yes, no doubt.

DAVID: On those hijackings, there was an expert or a semi expert who knew the language of flying, etc., but the muscle hijackers who wielded the box cutters, they didn't even speak English…they were parachuted in from Saudi Arabia.

GEORGE: I've always thought that other than the pilots, if there were pilots now, that the rest of the hijackers probably didn't think they were going to be dead…they probably thought something else was going to happen.

DAVID: I think it's the other way around…I think the expert hijackers, the Mohammed Atta, believed he was testing this electronic hijacking system, right? And pretending to be a hijacker. I don't think that he knew that the muscle hijackers in the first class compartment had the box cutters, and I think that they killed him as well. And then the plane, instead of crashing arbitrarily, was being flown remotely through the Boeing Iridium Satellite Communication System and the GyroChip installed inside the avionics.

GEORGE: What an incredible theory, David, absolutely incredible.

DAVID: And that's where you get the trajectory of the plane, which was way beyond the talents or the abilities of the people who were sitting in the cockpit.

GEORGE: How long was this thing planned?

DAVID: I think it started before the 1993 attack. I think the people who carried out the 1993 attack carried out 911, and I think you've got three networks inside the United States, which al Qaeda was using back in 1989, 1990. Let me just give you a quick insight into what al Qaeda is. Al Qaeda is the name the CIA has given to its database of special weapons and tactics teams operating in the Middle East. Al Qaeda in Arabic means `base' in English. And that database appears to have been stolen in 1995 or 1996 by the then Director of the CIA, John Deutch, who was pardoned by President Clinton on the 31st of January of 2001. (note: actually happened on 1/20/01) And John Deutch is the Professor of Chemistry at MIT and he's an expert on explosive hydrodynamics, which happens to be my area of expertise as well, and what you can do, George, with explosive hydrodynamics is you can hit a solid object like a steel girder or a human body with a shock wave travelling at five times the speed of sound with a temperature of around 5,500 degrees [Fahrenheit], and it turns into a plasma.

GEORGE: And down it goes…

DAVID: And down it goes…and there is no evidence of murder, and arson and fraud down in the debris pile of [WTC] buildings One, Two and Seven and if there is any remaining pieces, the Luchese crime family and the Teamsters and Waste Management, Inc., will take it out and put it under garbage hills One and Nine of the Fresh Kills Landfill on Staten Island, they'll flog the steel or what remains of the steel to India and Chinese smelters and they'll recycle it and they'll share the profits amongst them all.

GEORGE: God, David, what a theory! Well, thank you for sharing that…

DAVID: It's a pleasure George…

GEORGE: That is a different perspective than anything, anything that we've heard.